Re: [iPad] Apple TV question

 

Actually a typical DVR hard disk has enough space to record 80 1 hr hiDef shows in practicality, and usally 4 x that many SDef shows and some (Tivo devices) can record much more and some DVRs allow external hard disks.

Apple TVs and Roku and Fire TV have hard disks that can fail as well as can DVRs. But we don't control what they store,

Yes some streaming devices allow keeping content for later viewing. But they can flush the hard disk files if needed.

As for you saying "I had them before you" that is neither here nor there. Streaming devices can do some things DVR do and vice versa. It does not make them the same device. And if one is familiar with the full catalog of shows since TV and Movies were invented no, Apps and Sreaming Devices and Providers do not have the same availability,

Until HBO apps existed, for example Game Of Thrones could only be watched through HBO providers with and without DVRs or wait till the BluRays. So people with DVRs had contents apps do not. The world of TV and Movie content is way larger than you imagine and content providers have deeper providers and content in many cases although in a few years it may go the opposite way. 


On Sat, Dec 10, 2016 at 11:05 PM, Tony tdale@xtra.co.nz [iPad] <iPad@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
 

Going by the number of times you mention hard disk, I take it your HDD is unlimited as you seem to want to keep everything for a great deal of time? Clearly your TV channel provider has far more content than Netflix, Hulu, Amazon, etc, etc.


From: "Myrddin Wyllt myrddinwyllt1964@gmail.com [iPad]" <iPad@yahoogroups.com>
To: iPad <iPad@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, 11 December 2016 4:40 PM
Subject: Re: [iPad] Apple TV question

 
On Sat, Dec 10, 2016 at 9:41 PM, Tony tdale@xtra.co.nz [iPad] <iPad@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
 
Actually YES. I don't see anything in my post that is incorrect

OK then I will deal with any points you raise in this so you "get it".
 
Everyone knows a DVR is an expensive box that has a HDD in it.

No a DVR can record shows for playback later R stands for record.

If on a Tuesday Jan 1st,  2015 I record a show (lets call it "Xyz show on Network whatever") it is then a recording on my hard disk that is not removed until I tell it to. I can later replay it and skip commercials.

If I go to an App and watch that show and decide to watch it again 3 weeks or 3 months later and the App does not offer that show I cannot watch it again, show it to a family member or whatever. It is not likely to be on my hard disk, and there is no way to play it again.

NetFlix, Apps, Hulu, major networks change their availability of shows all the time. Lets take a few examples:
1) every month NetFlix removes TV and movie content and adds more. You cannot watch removed shows. If that same show or movie was on my DVR hard disk I can watch it as often as I want and re-watch it.
2) my SyFy channel app has almost no shows or movies I can watch on Apple TV/Roku/Fire TV. If for example I want to watch 12 Monkeys (the series) I can watch it if I DVRed it on my device anytime I feel like it. The App does not offer that and most TV shows or movies the SyFy channel airs. 
3) If I record a movie from any source (OTA, Providers) and DVR it to my DVR drive I can watch the movie anytime. If I decide to watch the movie 3 months later and the provider does not offer that movie I cannot. With a DVR I can watch it again.

Streaming TV can only show what the provider allows you to stream at the moment you decide to watch it.


My point was, Alice's ATV is effectively a DVR to all intents and purposes in terms of functionality. In todays internet world, who cares where the recorded content is?  The modern day "DVR" has everything pre recorded for you. 

By your absurd definition, a BluRay player is a DVR if it transfers the disk content to a hard disk. Words have meanings.

 
-Slow internet connections are a thing of the past for many.. Not all, but many. 3mbit is all you need or less.
-If a title was offered a week ago or longer and it is not there now, you cannot use a DVR to record it. Its not showing now
-IF THE APP offers it? If the title is also offered on linear TV. You can get more shows on SVOD than linear TV as linear TV is limited to 24 hours content per day

I recommend you try the 4 dozen streaming apps on my Apple TV and Roku and try the DVR I have with FIOS. The Apps in most cases do not offer all the content the DVR device does because of licensing agreements and lack of apps for every channel offering most DVRs (or OTA) has access to.

Please pay attention I have given you real world examples above.

My Mom records dozens of shows for herself and my brother that are available in NO APPS anywhere. One way or another her Content Provider has much more content than apps. If she records this, and my brother does not visit for weeks or months and the Content Provider quits offering that show she can still show it to him. Streaming devices change their offerings and quit some things and add more things but they are NOT ON YOUR HARD DISK so it will not allow you to watch something that they offered a month ago. Record a show a month ago, or buy it on BluRay and you can watch it when you feel like it and not use internet bandwidth to stream it.
 
-SVOD devices do not need to record, the content is always there

No it is not. Talk to some experts. Better yet watch a lot of shows on your Device and cut your internet connection. They will not play even if on the device because they cannot authorize your content. And if your connection is painfully show since this content has been "flushed" off your device they will use household devices bandwidth (i..e. your PCs, Macs, iPads and phones) on your networks will be sharing bandwidth with these streams and will be slowed accordingly,
 
-There is no guide, true, as there are no viewing times that you have to be aware of, viewing times in SVOD are anytime
Not even vaguely true.Viewing times of a DVR are basically anytime after they are recorded. If I record a Smallville re-run I can watch it any time later. If Hulu (the only App in US showing Smallville) drops Smallville I cannot watch it. Content is available when the agreement permits it.

See my examples above.
 
-If a show is on Linear TV but not on an app, thats not relevant, there are many that are not in linear TV as linear TV is too limited time wise.
My Mom has access to many shows that are not available on streaming apps. See above examples or do I need to provide a few dozen more examples? I watch a LOT of TV as does my family. My brother has streaming only and has to basically visit my Mom a lot to see things he cannot see on streaming. No Apps do not have the full range of old and new content that most DVR users have access to.

 
-If she uses FIOS, I gather thats fibre, it doesnt matter whether the internet is used or not. 
Don't know how to answer that. FIOS, Coax. internet is internet. Have no idea what you are trying to say here.

Me who might be trying to download an ISO or stream a HD or UHD video from Youtube or a Browser app (HBO, etc.) or play a video on my phone on her Wifi will do so quickly if she is replaying content for her hard disk. Slower if she is streaming since we share the pipe.

 
Seems to me that linear TV is smaller and simpler, and she is used to it, and the shows she lies are there. With SVOD there will no doubt be many shows that she likes that are also there, or there and not on linear TV although she wont know that so she wont miss it..
I tried for several months to get her going with the streaming devices. Well over 75% of what she wanted to see was not available on apps. She watches shows from several decades (as early as 40s, and very recent and everything in between) and many do not exist in Apps yet.

This has really happened. I have had similar experiences when looking for shows for myself or son or daughter or my nephews and nieces. I have a nephew that watches a ton of Anime that he has recorded on DVRs from providers that have not appeared on Crunchy Roll, Amazon Prime, NetFlix, Cartoon Network, etc. Except for some shows you do not seem familiar with what content can and cannot be streamed and the complex agreements that governed it. Marvel Movies (until a few months ago) were available for many people to DVR from their providers and watch anytime. Apple TV, Fire TV or Roku users would have to buy these explicitly and had no way to watch them except pay for them on a per show basis (and they may get "flushed from the hard disk so re-downloaded) and watch that way. A DVR user (like a BluRay user) would always be playing from a disk and not use bandwidth to watch it. 

 
DVR is simple and limited. SVOD, aka modern day DVR, is effectively unlimited, and also simple.

My examples (which I could provide several dozen if you were actually paying attention to what I said) show that no Apps are not effectively unlimited. Tell my brother who wants to watch a season of Penny Dreadful or Justified (the final season) that has not been made available in streaming Apps only a "pay for this" offering and he will tell you no the content does not match. Or when he wants to watch Dark Shadows or Wise Guy that my MOm DVRed for him off some obscure channel he cannot see via app.

Can he watch things not available on providers? Some content yes.  But trust me as the tech guy for a family full of TV and movie addicts apps are far from having all the content most LIVE TV people can DVR.
 
A well as a guide, i.e. the list of all the programs by category, in an easy to view grid layout (there is little need for too much text as there is no timetable to have to worry about) many will suggest programs based on previous usage. You can bookmark them, you can bookmark a season(s). 

Maybe its what she is used to. I have both. UHF HD DVR, Satellite STB DVR (PayTV),  ATV4 that includes OD for my available channels, as well as other channels that do not exist on linear TV. Each is easy as the other 

My Mom got used to a DVR quickly and finds a ton of content she cannot find on Apps and streaming BECAUSE THAT CONTENT DOES NOT EXIST IN THAT FORM YET because of contract issues. She records them on a hard disk and they don't get flushed unless she deletes them (unlike a streaming device that manages this flushing with no user control, and re-downloads content frequently and must "authorize" content).

I use my streaming devices much more than Mom and others but I watch a LOT LESS RANGE OF TV and MOVIES (and not spanning as many decades) and I often have to get certain content my friends and family want from DVRs that have "On demand" (which actually are streaming but in many cases more content is available on their DVRs than apps have) and recordings on her disk (and my DVR too) so no they do not offer the same thing and apps do not always offer more. I have season 2 of 12 Monkeys DVRed. This saves me having to buy them in App or BluRay form and the SyFy channel made them available via FIOS which I could DVR but no the SyFy app does not offer season 2. I can buy it several places or watch the DVRed shows recording on my device hard disk. When I watch the DVR shows the other devices in my house will not share the pipe with a download like that.

With 4k UHD devices (of which I have 2) the bandwidth needs are high as well way higher than ATV2 and definitely slow all other shared devices ability to download from Internet.
 



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Posted by: Myrddin Wyllt <myrddinwyllt1964@gmail.com>
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